How to Survive AI, Algorithms and Social Media Burnout ft. Emmelie De La Cruz
Ready to future-proof your business in an AI-driven world?
How do you actually build a brand and get sales when everyone's talking authenticity, but the rules keep changing? This episode uncovers the uncomfortable truth about personal brands, the surprising AI shifts reshaping marketing, and why most entrepreneurs are wasting time on outdated tactics. Victoria Jenn Rodriguez sits down with Emmelie De La Cruz, Bronx-born, ex-Meta exec, and fractional CMO to serious startups, to reveal:
How AI is upending content, lead gen, and trust online (hint: bots might read your emails more than humans soon)
The dangerous myth of “just show your authentic self” and what REALLY moves the needle in today’s noisy market
Street-smart, actionable strategies, from direct mail to A.I.-optimized content, that your competition probably ignores
Secrets to breaking through the algorithm without breaking your spirit (or privacy!)
Did you know? According to the United States Postal Service, real direct mail is getting opened more today because people are flooded with digital spam! It’s a cultural reset every ambitious entrepreneur should hear. Don’t miss the marketing shakeup that could save (or supercharge) your business in 2026.
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Victoria Jenn Rodriguez:
What's up, everybody? Welcome to Banking on Cultura. I am your host, Victoria Jen Rodriguez. And y', all, I got kind of like a celebrity on the show, and I'm really excited because you might have seen her on the scene back in the day, but lately she's been behind the scenes doing amazing work, especially within the marketing realm. And I'm really excited to have her on because she's smart as hell. She's like one of those Latinas with, like, a lot of fire in her and also a lot of intellect, which we love here on Bingi. Uncle Tura. And I'm just honored to have her on. I'm happy that she made the time to join us today. And I know this is going to be really fun and funny knowing her because she is a trip. But without further ado, Emily De La Cruz, thank you so much for joining us. I'm Biggie Uncle Tuda.
Emmelie De La Cruz:
Oh, my gosh. I'm so excited to be here. I've been admiring from afar, finally. Now that I'm back in New York City, I'm glad that we could do this. So I'm excited.
Victoria Jenn Rodriguez:
I know, because you was like globe dropping. You was moving from here to there.
Emmelie De La Cruz:
Like, I was in the south getting this cheap rent. Okay. But now that Mandani's in the building, I'm back.
Victoria Jenn Rodriguez:
Listen, shout out to Mandani and everything he's doing.
Emmelie De La Cruz:
Okay?
Victoria Jenn Rodriguez:
We love. We love a brave politician who's willing to push back. We do. We do. So for the people who don't know you, please introduce yourself to the people.
Emmelie De La Cruz:
Of course. So I'm Emily De La Cruz. I was born and raised in the Bronx. That is the one fact I always lead with because I think it really shaped me into the woman that I am today. I have been in marketing for the last 15 years and I am a fractional CMO by trade. So I really help smooth small businesses be able to operationalize their marketing so that they can grow and scale and eventually either exit their business, you know, sell things like that. So I focus a lot on growth. And in the space that we're in right now, I feel like marketing has just transformed so much. So now I'm also looking into, you know, like, the AI space, software, just technology overall, because I think all businesses eventually are going to be tech enabled, so. So really helping small businesses lead there as well.
Victoria Jenn Rodriguez:
AKA she's a little baggy. She is a milf. Sigh. You know, she's doing it. And really proud of you, by the way, because I'VE been connected to you for years on social media. And what I really appreciated about you was you were so different from every other quote, unquote, marketing expert on the map because you just delivered the information in a way where you thought you was talking to, like, your homegirl who was breaking down something really, really important to you. Which I appreciated, because at the time, nobody was really speaking to you with regular words. They were using SAT words. They were using all this technology that, like, did it make sense? You know? And I'm like, how the hell, you know, how. How do I understand this? How do I grasp this concept? And you had a way of. Of translating it and delivering it away, where it was like, okay, now I understand. Now I can go into a boardroom or a conference room and I can talk about tech in an intelligent way, because Emily put me on. On how to break this stuff down. So I really appreciate that. But also what I really loved is, is you are so transparent about your story, about your entrepreneurship journey, the pivots you had to make, the reinventions you had to make. I remember reading in your newsletter when you had decided that you were going to pick up and go, like, you left the city, and I think you were. I don't know if you were living in Atlanta at the time when you started your cleaning company. Were you in Atlanta?
Emmelie De La Cruz:
Yeah, I was in Atlanta, Yeah.
Victoria Jenn Rodriguez:
And you were just so audacious, and so, like, this is what it is right now, and this is what I'm doing. And then, like, you conquered that lane and then decided to go back into helping small business owners do their thing. So what was going on at that time? And also what made you say effort? I don't care what people think, because I think we're in an era right now where people are treading lightly because they're caring a lot about what other people think, and they are really nervous about reinventing themselves or just completely going left. So can you talk a little bit about that?
Emmelie De La Cruz:
Yes, I. It's so funny because there are so many pivots that I've made in my life, and I usually don't care because I feel like at the time when I was, like, teaching on social media, it wasn't the norm. Right? So, like, I think now being, like, a personal brand or a personality online carries so much weight than it did 10, 11 years ago. Like, 10, 11 years ago, we were posting salads, you know, reposting memes, talking about your ex. Like, you were on Instagram acting a fool. And I think now instagram has become this gallery, you know, this, like, art gallery of life. So people feel a little bit less inclined to want to share, like, the changes and the transitions that they're going through, because that's expected to be like, you know, your highlight reel. And I really actually love. I don't know if you've seen Danielle. Leslie has been posting on her substack.
Victoria Jenn Rodriguez:
Yes.
Emmelie De La Cruz:
Of a broke millionaire. So even when you were living in that time, you know, five, ten years ago, you're looking at all the girl bosses and it's like, oh, my God, their life is so perfect. But really, like, there's so much going on behind the scenes that they're not sharing because they. Their monetary compensation and their income is relying upon you being seen a certain way. But for me, because I never wanted to be an entrepreneur, I was forced to be an entrepreneur because I ended up getting laid off. I didn't care as much because people were investing in me and in my services because of what I knew and partially because of who I was. But my personality didn't carry my whole brand, if that makes sense. So the fact that I'm, like, going through a breakup, moving across the country, being here, there and everywhere, twerking on Instagram, smoking hookah, like, that didn't matter because the work was still good. But like I said, I just don't feel like now you can get away with that same type of behavior because the Internet has changed. But during that time when I moved to Atlanta, I, like I said, I was working. I always thought like, oh, I'm going to grow up and I'm going to become a cmo. And I ended up getting laid off twice in one year. So I had to take what I was already, like, openly sharing with people online. I was taking what I was doing at work and I was just like, freely sharing it on Instagram because I was like, yo, like, I want to help somebody. Especially being, you know, Puerto Rican and Dominican, growing up in the Bronx, like, everybody's an entrepreneur.
Victoria Jenn Rodriguez:
You have an Emily. Hold on one second. Share where you are working because I want to make sure people understand,
Emmelie De La Cruz:
like,
Victoria Jenn Rodriguez:
you was not that to play with then and now that to play with now. So let the people know you was working, girl.
Emmelie De La Cruz:
I've had so many freaking jobs, but I've been in tech most of my career. Most recently I was at Meta and then currently, right now I'm the head of growth at a company called Bubble IO. I worked at John Jay College, which was an amazing time. I worked at startups called Brand yourself. So I mall. I've been everywhere and nowhere, and I've worked with a lot of celebrities behind the scenes during that time as well. Like. Like, you see these celebrities, like, on your tv, you know, pretty frequently. So it's. It's been a journey because what I know and my relationships have gotten me so far, but I haven't, I guess, like, pimped out that information, really. Because, again, I really do want the work to speak for itself.
Victoria Jenn Rodriguez:
Yes. So I just needed to make sure, like, people knew, like, you built a level of credibility on the scene, and the work did always speak for itself. So that's a great point that you brought up about how you. You chose not to pimp it out, but at the same time, you also were showcasing a lot of your personality, and that was something that attracted a lot of people to you. And then you had to go through all these pivots, and you were sharing so much of what you were going through behind the scenes. And so for people who are there, how should they be thinking about how they share? Because you had said, now Instagram has shifted. And so before, you could twerk and post a salad and people might be, you know, interested in that, whereas now it's way more performative, really. So, so what are, what are your thoughts on how people can share in this climate where authenticity is, like, asked for, but if you're overly authentic, it might hurt your brand? Yes.
Emmelie De La Cruz:
First of all, I'm not going to go on Instagram crying. I think that's crazy. Respectfully, I know a lot of people that do it. You know, I've broken down a time or two, but I'm never going to be going through a mental breakdown and being like, you know what? Let me turn my phone on and go cry on Instagram. Stories like, that's bizarre to me. So I think that level of, like, quote, unquote, authenticity and vulnerability sometimes feels a little bit staged. And I always love the quote of, like, you know, show your scars, not your wounds. And I think we have this, like, trauma bonding culture on social media where the things that people care about the most is, like, all the dramatic things. Right. Like, we're seeing so many people now. Oh, I got divorced. Oh, I did you know my husband was cheating on me? Oh, yes, sharing.
Victoria Jenn Rodriguez:
I got an abortion with my first husband.
Emmelie De La Cruz:
You're doing too much. While that is important. Right. Because a lot of women can feel seen in those experiences. And it's important to talk about, like, I really value, like, all the people that posted mom content before I became a mom, because it really help me see and feel like, okay, I'm not alone. I'm not crazy. So I think that stuff is important. But I also feel like when you share from a retrospective point of view, where it's like, hey, I went through this. Here is what I learned, here's how I navigated it, and here's how you can, too, is really different from you sharing stuff right in the moment when it's super raw and when it's happening, because your point of view is just so, so different, you know? Um, but when I was building my brand online, I felt like it was super important to share all the things that I was going through, because again, like, I'm a girl from the Bronx, right? Like, I went to private school my whole life on scholarship. I went to Syracuse University, you know, on partial scholarship. So I vividly remember, like, being in college, and people would be like, you have an accent. Where are you from? And I'm like, what? What you mean I don't got no accent? Everybody talk like me, right? Like, I literally sounded like Cardi B when she was on Love and hip hop. Because when you grow up in the Bronx, right, everybody's Hispanic. Every. Like, I did not know any white people outside of my teachers until I got to college, right? So I vividly remember always feeling othered. And I'm like, if I feel othered and I'm educated, successful, et cetera. Like, what about the people who never left the Bronx, right? What about the people who. Who did not pursue higher education, they too deserve to. To know what it is that I'm talking about and to, like, have access to other things, right? Like, my friends from high school, my friends from middle school still follow me on Instagram. So it's like, if someone from corporate America and a childhood friend both see my content, like, I want them both to understand what I'm talking about and be able to apply that. So I shared a lot of context of what was going on in my life so people will understand, like, where I was coming from and how I was showing up the way that I was showing up. But it was also like, you can do it too, right? When I bought my first house in Atlanta, I started cleaning hotel rooms because I needed extra income. Because as an entrepreneur, when you write off all of your revenue, right, the bank is like, girl, you're broke. And you're like, no, no, no, no, no. But look, my income. And they're like, yes, your taxes say that you're broke. So we're not going to give you a house. So I had to get W2 income, right? And, and it's things that people don't talk about or share because it's, you know, finances are super private. But for me, it was important to me. Like, look, if you're an entrepreneur, this is the tea, okay? If you want to get a house, like, this is the T. And I've always just been a champion for like helping other people, especially like women and hood women, hood girls, be able to like do the things that society says that you can't or that you shouldn't want for yourself.
Victoria Jenn Rodriguez:
So for somebody who is going through something right now, the recommendation is talk about it when you're on the other side or when you're in a state where you can speak to it way where you are not working through it online at the same time that you are sharing it. Which is really interesting because last year or earlier this year I was sharing that I was going through this identity shift and I was really scared about it. And it was one of my most highly engaged content and it really made me think about, because I, I could see your point of view of, you know, don't share from the wound, share from the scar. But I can also see the benefit of bringing people on the journey in real time with you and how people stay, like, feel more connected to you in that way. But that might be the personal side, but does that actually convert on the business side? What do you think?
Emmelie De La Cruz:
That's exactly what I was going to say as you were talking. I'm like, it's one thing if you want to be a creator and you're monetizing based off of your followers, you, you know, the people that feel connected to you. Like, there's so many people that we love and listen to and their story is the content, right? So like, of course. But it's like when you're on social media trying to market yourself as an entrepreneur and you're trying to get business respectfully, the people don't care, right? Like the people that love me, that responded to all my stories, 90% of them never paid me a dollar. And that's fine, right? But it's just like you also need to know who you're working for and what you're working towards. So for me, it's important to separate using your personal brand to build like a personal branding empire and revenue stream and separating that from using your personal brand as the only marketing channel to grow a business. And the perfect example of this is Morgan debon So Morgan is the CEO of Blavity, but she also has a personal brand, right? She talks about motherhood, she has brand deals. She. She, you know, talks a lot about AI, but her personal brand and the things that people connect with her on her personal page have nothing to do with Blavity, right? Like, Blavity is a company that stands on its own. It has its own marketing team. It has its own marketing strategy. And some people don't know one or the other, right? Like, some people don't know that she's a CEO of Blavity. And the people that follow Blavity might not know that she's a CEO and that she's a mom. And, like, she moved to Nashville in the pandemic and she finally found love and got married. So. So it's just like, we need to understand and put on the right hat when we're going into social media, because oftentimes we'll build our brand in a very, like, personal quote, unquote authentic way. And then we're like, damn, like, what? Why isn't it converting to sales? And then you're burnt out and you're pissed off at the algorithm and you want to throw your whole business away, but it's because you're approaching your content like a creator and not like a business owner.
Victoria Jenn Rodriguez:
That's a mic drop right there. And I can see how a lot of people can. Like, those lines can be blurred because we have also seen how personal brands can elevate a business. Your example with Morgan, like, people are learning about Blavity through her sharing her personal story, right? We don't know what the data is in terms of what that conversion is like, but if we're just talking about awareness, right? It is bringing people into her ecosystem. So is there, like, a framework or how should people think about this? Like, I'm currently an entrepreneur, I'm an aspiring entrepreneur, and I understand the value of branding. How do I think about how I show up online if I understand that personal branding is a value add? But I don't know. Do you believe that personal branding is a value add, Emily? Because I know you have kind of an interesting perspective on that.
Emmelie De La Cruz:
I actually taught personal branding and it was like a lot of, like, my messaging back in the day. But what I've realized is, like, businesses that sell sell businesses that you can grow to be like a bajillion dollars, right? Like, the founder is not carrying the weight of the marketing, right? So, like, if you want to build a small business and you want to be the face. And you want it to be like, you know, like a mom and pop and you want everybody to know your name and fine, right. If you want to build a founder led beauty brand, fine, right. But we could also see how, how that just doesn't work for everyone. For every success story, like, you know, Hailey Bieber is Hailey Bieber and road and like all these other like huge brands that like the founder is doing the most on social media. We have a million stories where the founder is not the face of social media on social media. And I really think it comes down to two things. One, like I said, like the trajectory that you want your business because if your business relies on your face to grow, you can't exit it, right? Again, if you don't want to exit it, then this is not for you. But for me, I want to eventually build a business that I can exit, that I can sell and it being all rely on Emily is going to be really hard to do. And then secondly, thinking about what is it that my personality lends to, right? Because we also all want to build personal brands. We're not all charismatic, we're not all great public speakers, we're not all extroverted. Some of us, we don't look good on camera. Baby, your wig is crooked.
Victoria Jenn Rodriguez:
Not coming for the lace.
Emmelie De La Cruz:
It's not makeuping. And I would know because I have been on Instagram with my wig looking crazy, right? And I just feel like this whole just like show up as you are, it's just, it's a lie. Like people are not showing up as they are any longer, right? Like Cardi B is rich as hell. She went and got her whole body done. Her face, her teeth, the thought, right? And everybody loved Cardi B's personality. But it's like now we're just in an age of like people are just so vain and like aesthetics matter so much and like all of those things count. So yeah, it's just like you have to see like if it really matches your personality, if your personality can thrive in being like a front facing founder. And if you're not, I want people to understand that it's like there's another way to do business. Like the only way to do business is not to be a forward facing founder and to do founder led marketing, right? Like there's plenty of people who are not the face of their business and they still have successful businesses. So feel free to pick the lane that works for you and not feel like you have to do the lane that is most popular on social media. Due to just volume. Right. Like, naturally, the people who are making millions and millions of dollars off Instagram are not on Instagram telling you that they're making millions and millions of dollars off of Instagram. Right. The only people you're going to see on Instagram is the ones that are on Instagram. So I think we live in this, like, bubble that confuses, like, reality with, like, the illusion that we see online, if that makes sense.
Victoria Jenn Rodriguez:
Hmm. Okay. So is your recommendation that as a business owner, you build a personal brand?
Emmelie De La Cruz:
It depends, right? If. If you want to exit your business. No. If you are not going to add value. If your personal brand is not going to add value to their business. No. Right. Like,
Victoria Jenn Rodriguez:
if there's no connectivity there. If there's a. Like, if you ain't got the. The. The. What is that word?
Emmelie De La Cruz:
If you don't have the juice.
Victoria Jenn Rodriguez:
Yeah, if you would get the juice. Yeah.
Emmelie De La Cruz:
But also, it's just like, not every business. Like, if I own a Laundromat, I'm not gonna get. You can, but it's like, I'm not gonna get on Instagram be like, come with me to load clothes in the washing machine. As a CEO of Bubbles Inc. Like, it's just not necessary. Right. And I feel like because we see beauty brand founders, like, have to do it. You know, tech founders do it a lot. But it's like, Mark Zuckerberg is not going live on Instagram to tell you. Oh, my God. Let me tell you about the new features that my company launched. Like, he never did that. Right. So I think there is a place where it's like, you can be a thought leader, which is different from, like, just having a personal brand. And you can have a opinion and a point of view that's unique in the marketplace and that helps your company stand out. But again, like, being a personal brand and like having a content calendar and, like, doing all of that, I just don't think is required for every single business, and I don't think it is required for every single person either.
Victoria Jenn Rodriguez:
Okay. So you are in the marketing trenches. You're aware of trends, you're aware of things that are no longer a fit, given where we are moving. So what are you seeing? What are some things you're seeing in the space that entrepreneurs should be keeping in mind as they are thinking about this very, very difficult marketplace to. To grow in? What are you seeing?
Emmelie De La Cruz:
Yes, Artificial intelligence has disrupted all of the industries, marketing and business, specifically because five years from now, humans are not going to be the people consuming the Content, right? Bots are going to be doing it right now. I know plenty of people who, every day they don't even check their emails anymore, right? They have a agent that goes in and gives them a morning briefing. Here are all of your emails, here are the drafted responses. Here's what's coming up on your calendar. Like, people are becoming less and less connected to the content that marketers are so obsessed with creating. So, like, email marketing is going to change very quickly. Content creation is going to change very quickly. With AI, anybody can now make an AI twin, make an AI avatar, create AI produced content. So as more and more of that becomes commonplace on social media, the line between who's real and who's fake are gonna, are gonna really, really be very hard to determine. Like, it's so funny because when I come to my grandma's house, she always has univisiong on and all of the, like, lawyers, they're using AI in as their B roll. Like, I'm like, that is AI. You don't see her leg. I'm like, you don't see, her leg is blurry. I'm like, you don't see that hand. It got five fingers. So it's like even on tv we're starting to see like AI generated content being used in commercials. So it's like, imagine what a year from now social media might look like, right? So all of the human elements that we currently bank on for conversions, for interactions like the customer journey, it's just going to look so different because now you have artificial intelligence bots, AI agents now in the mix. So you're not just selling to humans, you're also selling to whatever mechanism is crawling your website or your social media content, etc.
Victoria Jenn Rodriguez:
So how the hell do we compete? Like, how do we, like, how do we survive? Because, Lord, like you mentioned email marketing. Like, I know email marketing is a huge way that people are cultivating their audience and also converting their audience. So if bots are going to be, I guess, the preliminary reviewer, like, how do we, how do we first of all, like, not only set ourselves up for success, but also stand out? Because if everybody's kind of playing in that same sandbox, then how do you actually, like, catch a wave?
Emmelie De La Cruz:
I'm looking at, I don't want to say old school, but traditional methods of advertising that we have that digital marketing has I kind of shit on for the last couple of years. So, like, direct mail. Direct mail still goes crazy. It works amazing. The United States Postal Service actually just put out a report around how More and more people are actually like opening their mail because there's just less mail being sent. Right. So while you have a crowded email inbox, your actual physical mailbox is, is empty. Right. So now more people are getting eyes on like direct mail because there's just not as much competition as there once was. Right. Your bills are online, they're on auto pay. So your mailbox is a great place. Billboards, right? Like there's no bigger credibility than seeing somebody on a billboard. Like I remember growing up, like seeing billboards like all over the Bronx and like, of lawyers, like, you know, of like, you know, accidents, like personal injury lawyers and like I still remember like 1-800-Contas. So like I'm still going to call them. I haven't, I have not gotten in an accident, thank God. But when I do, I'm going to call them. And it's like billboards that I've sought 25 years ago, you know, so I think billboards or like in marketing it's called out of Home. Out of Home is making a comeback. You might have seen another version of out of Home is like if you're downtown, there's like these like box trucks that have like these ads on them or like these screens and they just like drive around Manhattan like just moving billboards. Those are making a comeback. Experiential people love in person experiences. Right. Whether that's like a branded in person experience, like HubSpot, you started the inbound conference, which I don't know what its name now, but that made them like a thought leader in the space. They're a tech company who made it their mission to like once or twice a year bring marketers together. Yeah. So I think there's always going to be a place for like digital because it's not going anywhere. But I feel like after the pandemic and because digital has become so crowded and so cheap and easy to do those commercial. Like I said commercials like tv, right. I am cheap. So it's like I'm gonna pay for Netflix without the ads. But Hulu, I'm watching the ads at Hulu. I'm watching the damn ads. Because I'm not gonna keep paying everybody 30, $40. I'm um. So I think that like c. It's called Connected tv. So CTV is also something that. To look into podcast sponsorships. So it's just like how can you connect with somebody off of the screen is a lot of what I'm thinking about and what I'm recommending to my clients because just competing for clicks and eyeballs on a mobile phone is just no longer viable. It's too noisy and it's, you know, too complicated.
Victoria Jenn Rodriguez:
That is really interesting. So if I want to go mail something like, how do I get access to these lists?
Emmelie De La Cruz:
Like, where do I go on the USPS website? So your United States Postal Service that you pay taxes for, they actually have a service for direct mail. You can go on there, you can say, so I would do it backwards first. I would go on Claude, AI, Google, whoever and just find out like, where are your people? So like, let's say I'm going to use a super easy one. Let's say that you are someone who wants to sell to people who, you know, have a high household income, have children and you want to sell them, I don't know, pool equipment, right? So you would go on online and figure out like, okay, am I going to sell pool equipment to people who live in Alaska? Probably not. Am I going to sell pool equipment to people who live in Florida? Yeah. So then I'm going to go, okay, in Florida, where are the affluent neighborhoods or the affluent zip codes in Florida? Once you have that information right where you can find your, where your user or your customer is actually at, you can then go on the USPS website and you can put in those zip codes. So hey, I want to target, I'm just use the ones here in the wrong one. 0, 4, 6, 5, 10, 4 7, 8, 10 4, blah blah blah. It'll pull the list for you and then based on how big that list is, it'll give you a price. And that pricing is for them to print and ship the, the direct mail. So it could be like a catalog. I used to love a catalog. Still to this day, actual like postcard. So depending on like the, the mailer it's called or the piece, they'll give you a price. You upload your, you know, graphics onto the website and then they go and they take care of it. And you don't have to like do anything crazy. Pay anybody crazy. Like just go
Victoria Jenn Rodriguez:
get what this right here is like golden. Okay, so the prompt you're gonna put into a chat or Claude is basically trying to identify the zip codes where your ideal avatar client is. Then you create the graphic or whatever it is that you want to send as a mailer. The ups, the postal office will actually print it for you, give you your price, and then mail it out to all these.
Emmelie De La Cruz:
Correct.
Victoria Jenn Rodriguez:
Wow, that is incredible. I'm about to do that for my Morocco retreat. Dead ass.
Emmelie De La Cruz:
Like really Cool one. Which I've been doing this for a minute. So every time I go into the Apple Store, you know how all the Apple stores have all the computers? So I literally go on all the computers and I put my website on it and then I leave.
Victoria Jenn Rodriguez:
Yeah, I've done that before.
Emmelie De La Cruz:
Why not free marketing? Because I'm thinking, I'm like, okay, the people that are coming to the Apple Store are like buying a computer for work or for personal use. They're probably like some type of like tech savvy. So it's like, oh yeah, this is probably my person. So like let me just put my website up here and see if anybody needs some marketing.
Victoria Jenn Rodriguez:
I used to do the airdrop thing, but now Apple said, na son. Like they don't let you just airdrop to people.
Emmelie De La Cruz:
Yeah.
Victoria Jenn Rodriguez:
Unless they're not in your contacts. Like you can't really airdrop it out. I used to do that on planes. Like I'll be on a packed ass plane and I'll airdrop people my website.
Emmelie De La Cruz:
But now they don't get like any like responses. Like where people were like, hey, I
Victoria Jenn Rodriguez:
only got to do it like two times and then they shut it off. Because when I got put on to game it was already almost out of the wire. But I know people who did it like when nobody was doing it and they were getting responses, right? Because you just get this random thing on your phone, you're like, oh. You automatically like, oh. And this was before like spring Bam was od. This was before like the fear was in the marketplace around oh, don't open mail you don't know from someone like an email or don't open a text or whatever. So it was much easier to engage with people because there wasn't all this foolery going on. Right. But now people are so like they not picking up the phone if they don't know your number. In fact, now Apple, what they do if you're not saved in my phone, like you got to say who you are before the call goes through through. Which is annoying.
Emmelie De La Cruz:
I'm like, if the number is not saved, send to voicemail. Leave me a voicemail who you are and I will decide if I want to call you back.
Victoria Jenn Rodriguez:
But that sucks as a business owner because if you're trying to get in contact with people like via text or calling, like cold calling, like, you know, back in the days they used to literally sit at the desk and call up numbers on a printout. Now you can't even do that because you have all this technology that's like blocking it.
Emmelie De La Cruz:
Oh, that makes me think of too. Another thing that I recommend a lot of people look into and do now is figuring out. I don't want to say figuring out because it's not that complex, but how can you become the person or the company that AI cites when it's giving a recommendation? So I literally now use Claude for everything, right? Like, the other day I was like, I want to build an MCP which is like a connector to an LLM. Think about it. Like a plugin for ChatGPT or Claude. That's what like an MCP is, right? Like a plugin, like on WordPress, where it's like the plugin allows you to, like, do a specific set of things on your WordPress website.
Victoria Jenn Rodriguez:
Like a zapier. Almost like a zapier.
Emmelie De La Cruz:
Yeah. Like, it'll. Like an MCP is basically like a connection between, like an external software or piece of tech with the LLM. So.
Victoria Jenn Rodriguez:
And the LLM is like chat or Claude.
Emmelie De La Cruz:
Yes, yes.
Victoria Jenn Rodriguez:
Okay, girl, you got to break it down for people.
Emmelie De La Cruz:
Yes, LLM. So an LLM is a large language model, and that basically means, like, all of the data that a specific AI platform is trained on. So, like, you know, ChatGPT has like all of their different versions, like Claude has like Opus and Sonnet and like all of these. So, like, all of those are different models that were trained in different ways in order to be able to. To do different things, right? Like, you wouldn't want somebody that was trained to be a heart surgeon doing your bbl, right? Like, there is not the same training. It's not the same training. They could probably do it, right, because they have enough general knowledge to like, figure it out, but you wouldn't want that. So it's the same thing with the models. Like, the models are trained to be able to do specific things. So some are like, really great for coding, some are specific to producing video and photos, some are for audio, some are for transcription. So there are multiple models that exist on all of these different AI platforms to be able to accomplish different things. But one of the things that I've noticed is now when I'm like, shopping, you know, like before everything used to live and die through a Google search, but now I search a lot on TikTok, right? Like, I'm searching every single random thing. Like, how can I get my HP washer to stop showing me XYZ error, right? Like, before I would literally go on Google and type that, but now I can literally go on TikTok, find a video Figure out my heights, my how to and go about my day. So treating the algorithms like it's Google and thinking about it, okay, what is my ideal customer searching for? And how can my reels or my TikTok videos or my website content be the thing that is suggested did because now people are not leaving to go to your website as much. They're consuming the information on the platform that they're getting it right. So they're watching the video on TikTok, they're checking out on TikTok, they're watching the video on Instagram, they're going to scroll to the next thing on Instagram. So you have to think about like, if people are not coming to my website, how can I get my content to them? And with the AI now if you ask it, ChatGPT has ads, but like, if you ask Claude, like look online and tell me what are the trendiest sunglasses that I can get for under 25, right? Like it'll give you a suggestion like, hey, check out this brand, check out this brand, check out that brand. Same thing with like software. I'm like, hey, how can I build an MCP if I'm a non technical person? Meaning I don't know how to code. Oh, check out this brand and this brand. Brands I have never heard of, brands that did not come up when I like searched on Google. Brands that I wasn't seeing ads for. But the AI takes into consideration what you're saying and what it knows about you to make these personalized recommendations. So now when I'm like, okay, how can I find a luxury nail nail shop in the Bronx if there's no nail salon in the Bronx that has a website that says that it's a luxury nail shop in the Bronx, ChatGPT and Claude are not going to have anything to recommend. Right. So you're thinking less about your website being a place where you're trying to drive traffic to and and a place where you want traffic to be extracted from. If that makes sense. Yes.
Victoria Jenn Rodriguez:
No, let's break that down a little bit. So what I'm hearing is that you're suggesting that content that you are creating should be searchable. So a lot of how to's and
Emmelie De La Cruz:
assume that that content is it, right? Like no, like, oh, I'm gonna give you three tips and then go to my website to watch the webinar. They're not going to your website to watch the webinar. They're hip on the webinars at this point, right? So it's like give them the information in the video, give them the information in the caption. Like, the people are not leaving the social media sites as much as they were before. Now you have obviously like the many chat automation, you know, comment XYZ and I'll send you the link. I would love to see a published report of like how many people actually go and click the link. I just want to know because I'm like, I just know that it has decreased over time because people can now just get the information. So, yeah, assume that the content that you're creating, it's being seen by a person who's never heard of you before and that person is trying to get all their information in that place and they're not going to go to your website to get more. So like, I hate when I see a company go viral. So, you know, I recently moved back home, so I'm trying to like find places to eat, places to go, and it's like, come with me to this amazing sushi bar. Where's the sushi bar? Is it in New York? Is it in the Bronx? Is it in Brooklyn? Is it in Queens? What time is it open? Where's the address? Like, it's just like little stuff that it's like I'm somebody who has never heard of this place and you're giving me no information and I'm too lazy to now go into Google and try to find the place. Like, I'm just going to scroll and go somewhere else, Right? So it's like little basic stuff like that that is so annoying to me as a user, but as a marketer, I'm like, you just missed out on the lead because what if that place was two blocks away from my house? And now I'm not going to go because you didn't tell me, not even the borough that it was in, let alone the street or the city or the county.
Victoria Jenn Rodriguez:
Hmm. So then what is your recommendation to organically get leads? Like, if you're saying like, oh, you know, comment, whatever, and you get this free downloadable, are you suggesting, like that is not like a wave anymore?
Emmelie De La Cruz:
No, because why would I download your PDF when I can just ask Claude or chat and get the same answer, Right? Like, people are less likely to want to consume information. Like, they don't want to be informed anymore, they just want to be instructed. Like, how do I do the thing? Right? So you've seen the change, likely, like the course industry and like the coaching industry, where before people used to pay so much money for information because they were information starved. Now because we're in the age of information overload. People have too much information to shift through, so they're not going to want to read your PDF that you likely wrote on AI anyway. Like, they're just like, just tell me what it is. Like, just, just tell me the thing. Right? So I think in order to get leads, you have to think about if you're a digital business, like what I call micro tools. So let's say that you are, I don't know, give me, give me a business example. Like, you know your listeners better than me. So are most of them like coaches? Are most of them like small business?
Victoria Jenn Rodriguez:
Most of them are consultants and coaches.
Emmelie De La Cruz:
Okay? So if you're a consultant or a coach and you're like, download this PDF to learn my signature method, or come to my webinar where I'm going to teach you the three ways to do, do, blah, blah, blah, I don't have time for that, right? I would much rather a micro tool or a quick experience where I can just do the thing that you're allegedly going to teach me. Right? So, like, let's say that you are, I don't know, a finance coach, right? Instead of giving me a PDF on like, how to budget so that you can buy your next house, I would just make a calculator. And it's not as hard as it sounds, I promise. I. I would make a calculator that's like based upon my, I don't know, 50, 30, 20 budget rule and the current mortgage rates and the average cost of a house in, you know, each state help a person be able to calculate how much they need to save every month in order to buy a house in the next year, right? That sounds really complicated. But to AI, AI is like, all right, bet, like boom. And they go to work, right? And you can literally ask like in. I use Claude, so I'm going to keep referring to Claude, but you can do this in any AI. Like help me make a calculator that does XYZ Elemental P and you can go back and forth with it and eventually it'll give you an output of like an actual artifact, if they call it an artifact, or like an interactive website that you can use to do the thing, right? One of the things I'm working on with like my software clients is like eliminating your tech stack. So a lot of business owners, they have a disjointed tech stack, right? They have Thrive Card over here, Kajabi over there, Squarespace over here. Their email is in kit, their thing, their forms are an air table. They're just like, you know what? How can I buy every single piece of software and then try to connect it with Zapier? The problem with that is, one, it's mad expensive because you're paying for all of those things individually. And two, your data isn't centralized. So when your data is not centralized, it's really hard for you to analyze your business and, like, make things make sense. So instead of me constantly having to like, repeat myself, I literally created what, a calculator. And you can click all of the different tools that you use. It will add up. You know, how much it's costing you per year to have all of this disconnected software versus what it will cost you if you just built something for yourself from scratch without code. So that is a better lead magnet that people are more willing to interact with because it's personalized to them. It's live, they can use it and it's quick. Like, they don't have to read a, you know, PDF or like, attend an hour long class where I'm like, trying to explain, like, you know, you having a disconnected software system is breaking the bank. It's like I can see right there that I can either pay $5,000 a year or I can pay $800 a year and have all my software connected and in one place, right? So thinking about what those aha moments are for your ideal customer and how you can make them an experience. Experience that they don't have to consume, they don't have to learn, they don't have to, like, use too much of their brain, honestly, to understand what it is that you're selling. I feel like, is the next wave of, of like, lead magnets in this era.
Victoria Jenn Rodriguez:
Damn y', all, we just gonna be dumb. Like, nobody, like, nobody is gonna think anymore. Like, we literally are taking, like, thought of everything.
Emmelie De La Cruz:
And what if you think about it, if you're a consultant, you want to be paid to think, right? Like, for your client. Like, you're helping them, you're taking them through a journey. So it's like you don't want to teach your client, here's exactly how to do it yourself. Because then, like, why would they pay you? You know, so you also need to like. And same thing with services too. It's like, I don't want to know how to do my own taxes, just tell me how to better, you know, do my bookkeeping so that I can save more money at the end of the year. So yes, I think that people are spending their time on the things that actually matter now versus consuming a whole bunch of information that is irrelevant.
Victoria Jenn Rodriguez:
You know, that's a great point. And I think it also matters on who is your client avatar. Because if you're dealing with a more sophisticated avatar, what you are describing is like how we want to consume. Right. It's how we want to learn and expand. But if you're not working with someone or you're not targeting someone who is as seasoned on their journey and they're just looking for like maybe some quick fixes that is informative, you might still be able to leverage that. Because people are still going to pay for information. They're still going to pay for it. So I think there's a lane there still. It's, it's how it's delivered. And to your point, like what is the value add of them going to download the PDF? Like what are they going to be able to do? I think is important, but I still think there's, there's opportunity in both lanes. You just have to be creative in how you are presenting the information.
Emmelie De La Cruz:
Yeah. And I always like to remind people that you need to understand the consumer that you're going after. Right. Because there are two types of people that purchase. There's a person who values their time and there's a person that values their money. Right. Usually the things that you value are the things that you have the least of. So if I'm super busy, I don't care if I have to pay $2,000 to pay somebody to do something for me because I don't have the time to learn. But if I don't have a lot of money, the only thing I have is time. So I'm forced to usually go the DIY route. And the reason why a lot of people get frustrated, especially when they market their business, is because they're dealing with a higher value consumer who really values time. But they're trying to sell things based on price or they have somebody who is very price sensitive and, and they're trying to like sell them services, for example. So you need to understand like who is the person that you're talking to and what do they value so that you can create your offers and price accordingly and market accordingly. Right. Like the things that I sell like as a fractional CMO, like not everybody could pay $8,000 a month. Like that's not cheap, you know. Right. But the person that can pay that is in a, at a certain level in their business or in their, you know, career and they have disposable income, they have margin in their business. So they're not looking for how to tips on social media, right? They're just like, who can. Who knows my problem and who can solve it? That's it, right? Versus, like, the person who's a teacher and makes, you know, $80,000 a year and is a mom. Like, they don't have that money to shell out. So they might be looking for, like, how do I build an AI agent to do my marketing course, right? But if I was talking to that person who's looking for a course, trying to sell them an $8,000 service, like, it's never going to work and vice versa. If I approach somebody who has the disposable income and just wants a service provider, and I'm like, take my group coaching program. They're going to be like, girl, I'm not. No. And that happened to me very early on in my career. I would get so frustrated because I was trying to do the coaching thing, and everybody would be like, girl, no, can I just pay you to do it? Like, I don't want to be in nobody's coaching program. And then that's eventually how I ended up pivoting into fractional CMO services because I would try to force my client, who was so busy and, like, so successful, into this, like, group container. And they're like, bitch, I told you, I don't want to be with these other hoes on Zoom. Just do my damn marketing. Just do my damn marketing. And that's really, like, when. When my business changed because I started to my consumer, like, how she lived, like, what she valued and time was it, you know?
Victoria Jenn Rodriguez:
Oh, my God, I love it. Emily, where can people find you? How can they stay in contact with you and just enter your world?
Emmelie De La Cruz:
Girl, find me in these New York streets on the 2 and 5 train from time to time. No, seriously, find me on Instagram. So I'm Emily Delacruz. Do I be there all the time? No. No. But when I pop up, it's a good time. My LinkedIn, of course. So you can find me on LinkedIn. Emily Della Cruz. Let me know in the personal note. You know that you listen to the episode. I would love to connect. And then I also have my own show called Sanity and Success as well on Apple and Spotify. So you can go back and listen to some of my episodes. Some of it is about marketing, some about. Some of it is about, you know, like, battling depression. Some of it is about, like, moving to a new city and being lonely. So truly talking about, like, the Things that are required to chase success, but also, like, remain grounded and sane in the process is what that show is about. So feel free to find me there as well.
Victoria Jenn Rodriguez:
I love it. Thank you so much for dropping Gems. Listen, I was taking notes, girl. I was like, ooh, I was this close to making you break down a whole strategy for me right now for my Morocco retreat.
Emmelie De La Cruz:
But I was like, nah, I'm not
Victoria Jenn Rodriguez:
gonna do it because you were dropping
Emmelie De La Cruz:
so much, girl, the way that you needed your strategy for the Morocco retreat. These gas prices is going to be $2 million to fly to Morocco, girl. You need to take them to the Rock's neck. Okay. To the hookah lounge.
Victoria Jenn Rodriguez:
No. Okay.
Emmelie De La Cruz:
We would just have to. You know, I'm mad, long winded, so just chop another part of the episode, and then we can still do the. We could do a Morocco retreat breakdown.
Victoria Jenn Rodriguez:
No, no, no. This was really good. Everything that you shared here was really, really good. I mean, I am a very lucky girl that I got direct access to you, but I'm. I'm really excited to get this out to the world and shout out to everybody who's tuning in, who's listening. We're using Riverside for the first time. This is the first time I'm using this software to bring this episode to you. So for those who are watching, let me know what you think, because it's. It's not the normal studio setup that you're used to seeing. And also those on the audio streets, like, what do you think? Because, listen, honey, we are getting creative on how we are bringing this information to you, and sometimes it doesn't always make sense to do it in a studio. Like, sometimes I might have to do things virtually, and so I want to make sure that you guys still value the content. So make sure to leave your feedback for this episode. Let me know what you think. Connect with Emily. And Emily, when we drop this episode, that's when you're making a comeback onto the social media platforms because we got to get this information out to the world. Thank you so much for joining me on baking, Uncle Tura. I really appreciate you and keep kicking ass and telling your stories because I love being on this journey with you.
Emmelie De La Cruz:
Thank you so much. So glad to be here. And, yeah, we definitely have to come back for a part two.
Victoria Jenn Rodriguez:
Absolutely. All right, bye, everybody. I'll see you in the next episode.
KEY TAKEAWAYS:
Scarcity isn’t survival—it’s sabotage. Wealth starts where self-doubt ends.
Only 10% of your cheerleaders ever become your clients—learn to market to buyers, not fans.
AI is already changing who sees you and how you get paid. Innovate, or become invisible.
Direct Mail sees higher open rates now than most inboxes—old school is the new luxury.
If your business is you, you’re not building an asset—you’re building a job you can’t leave.
Solve premium problems, and charge premium prices. Money flows where time is valued.
ABOUT THE GUESTS
Emmelie De La Cruz’s journey begins in the Bronx, a place she credits for shaping her drive and resilience. With over 15 years in marketing, Emmelie has carved out a niche as a fractional CMO, specializing in helping small businesses operationalize their marketing to fuel growth, scale, and eventual exits. Recognizing the rapid transformation in her industry, Emmelie has turned her focus to emerging technologies, including AI and software, understanding that tech enablement is the future for all businesses. Today, she’s committed to guiding entrepreneurs through this evolving landscape, drawing on her roots and expertise to empower others on their paths to success.
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